Interviewer: First thing I want to know: your name, pronouns, and a little bit about yourself.
Sylas: You go first.
Will: I’m Will, he/him… A little bit about myself? I’ve been climbing for almost a year—started at Crag X. What do I do? I do a bunch of sports, I do software, and I am biking through Saltspring tomorrow. That’s me.
I: Ooo! That sounds fun. I haven’t been to Saltspring in so long, I was actually just thinking about it. Did you know there is climbing there?
W: Yeah! Actually, I saw the guidebook near the front desk and I’m probably going to be picking it up soon.
I: Hell yeah.
W: Yeah, Mt Maxwell—I’ve been there to hike, but I haven’t seen where the anchors are or anything, so… I don’t know where the actual climbing is!
I: Interesting! Probably some nice sport. How about you?
S: Name is Sylas. Pronouns he/they. I started climbing when I was twenty, climbed for about a year then took a long break and started again around a year and a half ago. I’ve had some time off with surgery and illness, but consistently for the last year. Just moved here from qathet, Powell River. I am short, but I seem tall.
I: That is very true. How tall are you again? 5’4”?
S: Yeah.
I: Yeah that doesn’t make any sense to my brain.
S: I know, I love it. Somebody was telling someone about me and said that I was 5’8”. I was like, “Sick!”
I: Yeah. ‘Cause I’m 5’8” and I feel like I’m 5’10” and then I also feel like you’re my height.
S: [laugh] Oh my gosh that’s so nice, thank you.
I: Those people with tall energy… I am one of them, but I’m actually not one of them. Tragically. When I was a kid I wanted to be 6’1”, a beanpole, and have really big feet. And I got the opposite of all of those things.
S: You’ve got small feet?
I: Yeah, I’m almost 5’8” and I wear women’s size 7.
S: 5’8” is taaaall for an AFAB person.
I: Yeaaaah, but it’s not 6’1”. I’m not breaking any records here.
S: Well, you’re still stretching, so.
I: Yeah. [laugh] I just need to hang on the pull-up bar for an hour and then I’ll get there. You’ve both been climbing for a year only?
W: Yep!
I: Aw, you’re climbing babies, just like me. You’re both really good, though. You lead a lot, which I love to see—when did you decide to do lead?
S: I wanted to do it forever, but the gym I climbed at in qathet was basically a bouldering gym—there was no leading. If you wanted to lead, you had to learn outside, so I had to try and find somebody to teach me outside, which was a whole thing. Then I came here and my goal is to climb outside during the summer, so I went to one of the GOATS climbing events at… Sully’s?—
I: Oh! They do them at Stelly’s?
S: Stelly’s? Wow, I’ve called it everything else.
I: They also call it The Boulders.
S: But it’s not—it’s mostly lead and top-rope.
I: Yeah… [laughs]. I get it confused all the time too.
S: Not just me. But yeah, Sarah, one of the GOATS, is certified to teach lead and is a teacher there, so I got a lead course for like… $20 and immediately, the next day or two, came here to do a lead test. And then Will and I met at a Friendly Friday and I said “Hey, let’s fuckin’ lead climb.”
I: That was going to be my next question: how you two met.
W: FF!
S: Except it was really funny because there were a bunch of people and I was like, “Oh hi, hello!” except I didn’t have my glasses on and Will was sitting across from me and I literally just squinted at him and he kind of looked at me and waved a bit and then carried on and later I was like, “Hey… I thought I recognised you…” and then squinted at him to see him better.
W: [laughs]
I: [laughs] What did you think Sylas was doing when you saw that?
W: I don’t know, I don’t think I registered it that way. You were trying to figure out if I was part of Friendly Fridays was the vibe I was getting. You came in a couple minutes after me so I was already partnered off with the first rotation and then you came in and partnered off with some other people who came in, so I was pretty sure you were with Friendly Fridays. You look like you’re not sure, but I’m pretty sure.
I: That’s why we have the buttons… Though I’ve still never been to Friendly Friday or GOATS.
S: Really? Everyone there was awesome and I got a climbing partner, which was really nice. GOATS was super awesome, GOATS is great.
I: They pop around gyms, right?
S: Yeah, they were here on Wednesday.
I: It was? Really? When?
S: Seven through nine.
I: Oh, that’s why. I worked during the day so I missed it. Too busy doing DnD.
W: What edition?
I: Five. Playing a new character, which is really fun. We’re level one… Level one! I have 10HP. Back to climbing before it’s too late and I talk about DnD all day. What do you like about climbing for yourselves generally?
W: I like that it’s a full-body exercise, I like that it’s got a bit of a puzzle element, too… I really like the progression of learning skills and then [laughs] hitting a very hard plateau.
I: [laughs] So true.
W: And then you really have to work hard to get to the next level. I find that challenging, but more rewarding because of the challenge. Those are some of my reasons.
I: Yeah… that 5.10d to 5.11a plateau… When I came back after my seven-year hiatus, that was gutting. Truly.
W: [laugh]
I: You’re in software you said?
W: Yes.
I: The way you described what you like made me think of how many people are in software or are developers and really like climbing and I think a big part of that is the problem-solving aspect.
W: Totally.
I: How about you, Sylas?
S: I find it very meditative, which is also really good for my ADHD brain, of using my whole body and also having to—it’s like mountain biking: if you’re not paying attention, you’re going to eat shit, you’re going to fall off the wall. If I don’t know what my feet are doing, that’s it. It’s also very—I don’t know if I want to get into this too much—but it’s really gender-affirming. Helping build my upper body strength a lot. It’s always felt really good for me to do things that help me feel stronger, like… my whole life. It’s also a way that I met a lot of really nice people when I was going through a hard time and was really isolated. I found people at the gym, which was really nice. It’s very present. I’m also very competitive with myself. I like to see the progression and I like to, when you hit those plateaus, ask: “How am I still progressing?” instead of just going, “Fuck! I can’t do this. This is stupid! I could do this last week, why can’t I do it now?” Instead, it’s “How am I still progressing? What did I do this time that I couldn't.” Just getting on the wall is a huge accomplishment and it’s been really good for my brain.
I: Yeah. Totally get that. I love this part of the interview because it fills me with the warm fuzzies because I love climbing and everyone has different answers, but a lot of overlap. It’s so nice. Yesterday I was working, sitting at the desk, and I literally got emotional watching people climb. I was like, “I love it so much!”
S: It’s really great. I have to cap it, I feel like I could go on forever.
I: It’s a great way to meet yourself where you are, I find. I’m really bad at overshooting and giving up because I can’t meet my high expectations, but you can just show up. You can tell pretty quickly if it’s a shit session, so I just decide “Okay, I’m going to hang out with people I like and do a sport I like.”
S: Even if it’s not topping everything to the max.
I: You don’t have to be your best all the time.
W: Yeah, for sure.
S: I heard a really good phrase from Ivan Coyote: “Cowboy down.”
I: What is it?
S: I feel like it’s definitely in the climbing world and also in the transmasc world, and being a short king, it’s like “Bro, let’s be stronger and push ourselves.” I’ve always been like that, of going 120% to the point of being not good for me. So with climbing, I decided: let’s have a nice time, let’s have fun.
I: Speaking of where you wanna go and striving for greater things, do you have any goals for the future with climbing? It’s officially the outdoor season, so I’m hoping to get out there.
W: Yeah, that’s definitely on both of our roadmaps for the next thing. I was looking at the outdoor courses here and debating whether I should go for the lead climbing versus top rope one—
I: I can answer that for ya…
W: Oo?
I: I just did the Transition to Outdoors course about three weeks ago—
W: So fresh!
I: If you know how to lead, I’d say do the lead one. Harry teaches you how to set up top rope anchors and lead lower and rappelling, so if you can lead, I’d say do the lead. I think the top rope emphasises the approach and setting up top rope anchors, whereas if you can lead you can just… get the fuck up there. [laughs]
W: [laughs] Start from the bottom and go up.
I: Yep. Sorry, continue.
W: Yeah. Transition to Outdoors, taking the course to get a little more confident with safety equipment, and being more of a trip lead on those sort of adventures. It’s been challenging to find partners at the gym even, and with the barriers to outdoor—cost, travel, scheduling and all that—it’s harder to organise. So, getting more of those skills on our team to set up and schedule those things is a big goal, for sure.
I: Definitely super worth it. I always felt bad going outdoors after coming back to climbing and sitting there like, “I don’t know how to do anything” even down to gear management and how to best store stuff, just sitting there for thirty or forty minutes while your friends are setting up anchors… So I thought, yeah, as soon as I can, I want to learn to be a useful member.
W: Yeah, how to contribute.
S: You gotta start somewhere, though. I feel like I’m very happy to help people. With the GOATS nights, I’m belaying people who are brand new and taking responsibility for them, which is nice because most people… it’s just nice to have more people climbing.
I: I did a Workplace Day Out here and we as employees just belay people and teach them about different aspects of climbing for a couple hours and I really enjoyed it. Everyone’s psyched about something different.
S: Sounds fun, though tiring on the neck… You gotta wear belay glasses, maybe.
I: I cannot wear those things.
W: No?
I: Have you worn them? If you look up and down slowly nothing bad happens, but as soon as you turn your head, it feels like the whole world spins. It feels disorienting.
S: It’s weird. But for such a big wall… I feel like I do notice that, especially because you’re just crunching your traps for so long.
I: The hack to that is to always have a sore neck.
W: [laughs]
I: What about you Sylas? Goals for the future?
S: Climbing outside. That’s what I want. That’s it… Though, one day I think I’d really like to try trad climbing, but that’s in the future. And not crazy…
I: Not going to England and trying the spooky ass shit they do?
S: Is England notorious for trad climbing?
I: They’re are insane lines there. You should watch some videos, it’s intense.
S: Damn, okay. I don’t know, though, I feel like I don’t really want to have too lofty of goals. I just want to get outside. I have a car, a 4x4, so I can be the car dad—
I: Honestly a flex for climbers. Having a vehicle? My god…
S: Seats, seatbelts, four-wheel drive, roof rack?
I: And a license, I assume?
S: I do have a license. Bonus, I also have a large, fluffy dog who is part of the package. But yeah, I need to learn about anchors. Maybe Will will teach me and I can do the driving.
I: Seems like a fair trade off.
S: I also want to do some hiking. I’ve done some free climbing in some sketchy situations and it would be cool to do some mountaineer-y climbing.
I: Like alpine climbing?
S: Maybe ice-climbing for fun…
I: Ice-climbing… for fun. That’s your toned down version?
S: Yeah! I had a friend who was ice climbing in qathet down by the bridge. I just think I’d like to take the gym-climbing outside is the goal. Also to get better at using my hands instead of just matching and using my leg power instead of my arms. I do a lot of—I broke my arm, so it’s a lot weaker, so I want to work on technique stuff.
I: I feel that. When I lead I’m always clipping when locked off, but that’s the worst way to clip. You wanna have straight arms so you’re not wasting energy. I’m quite bad at just hanging.
S: Gotta do the orangutan.
I: Lastly, anything else you wanna talk about at all? |
S: That’s too open-ended, I have ADHD.
I: [laughs] About climbing.
S: Well, I think climbing needs more diversity, still… Like, if you don’t have a certain body-type, or income—actually, that’s something I really like about this gym. I was able to get a sliding-scale membership, ‘cause otherwise I wasn’t climbing, really. Once a week, maybe. I noticed the impact on my mental health. That it was made accessible for me is huge. Massively, in many different ways: socially, emotionally, spiritually… financially.
I: All of the ways.
S: It’s really, really beneficial and I think finding ways to make it more accessible and appealing to people who wouldn’t think that they would be able to climb, or that it would be something they would like… I feel like it was really hard for me to go to the gym in qathet and I lived there for five years before I went to the gym. I wasn’t friends with people who were climbers and found it really hard to go to the gym and start again. I thought, “I have to start again. I suck at this and it’s going to be embarrassing and I’m not going to be strong.” It was hard. I just feel like we gotta work to make it more inclusive and easier to access.
W: On that note, I’ve appreciated that there are a lot of diverse people and age groups, especially, too, with climbing, which makes me feel really good. With certain sports you think, “Oh, this is something I can do for a couple of decades, if I’m lucky.” Seeing very young people, very old people, everyone in between, climbing at the gym is really inspiring. It makes me excited that this is a sport that pretty much anybody can do in whichever way they can for pretty much their whole life. I really like it.
I: I love seeing the eighty year olds crushing harder than I ever have. You’re like, “That could be me someday!” It’s a for-life sport. It’s really rare. Anyways, thanks for talking to me, that was really nice.
W: Thanks for talking to us!
